Author Topic: One trip too many for DS  (Read 565 times)

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Terry

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One trip too many for DS
« on: April 22, 2018, 08:05:35 PM »
Hi,

A few months ago I didn't renew the rego on DS and just left the Moke to gather dust as I was planning to strip the engine and find the low oil issue and give it all a Mokeover before the Swim in August and I thought maybe get on to club plates at the same time. So with a few days before I could still pay the rego without getting a RWC, I started thinking....

It was a Wednesday evening at 5pm and I was just finishing up some work on another  Moke and I started thinking I could take a few days off and head up to MJB and say hello to a few friends etc, so by 5:20pm I had got DS out covered in dust and cobwebs.


So I hosed the crud off and checked the fuel pump was pumping okay as that was faltering in the last few km's of the last trip I had in DS on and could hear a bit of rattle but didn't have time to look so went off to basketball and got home around 10pm. Jumped in DS to go and get some petrol in the tanks in case I decided to leave in a few hours. The rattle really was bad so in the lights of the servo I eventually found the radiator fan was loose on the bolts, or so I thought. Back home and I had the radiator leaned forward, Exports are great, and the found the bolts were not loose so with the radiator out, fan off to find the water pump shaft was moving considerably and it was not leaking water.

I fitted a new'ish water pump I had previous used on a new engine for a few thousand km's but I suspected it was part of under cooling issue so I had replaced it along with the radiator but figured it would get me to NSW and back. So finished up in the wee hours, grab a few hours sleep and back out at daylight to pack the Moke and head off.

Took the boring road, the Hume Hwy, just to be quick and along the way I wanted to try out the self serve public weighbridge which costs $0 near Broadford so after a bit of playing around to make sure of the numbers I straddled a couple of scales and got the front and rear axle weights and the total for DS in road trim which is not carrying all the things I normally do and about 40lts fuel.


Moving along the highway the temp was above its normal position and with that means the oil pressure was a bit lower than the normally low but still manageable so I tucked in behind a couple of trucks as the side wind was really not helpful. Rolling into get fuel at the BP outside Wadonga I had a new experience, I couldn't get out of 4th gear so with a bit of clutch work I managed to roll and shudder my way across to the big parking bays with the trucks and set abut underneath to see what was going on. After an hour and half I had managed to get it to go in and out of 4th but nothing else. So after some rubbery food I rolled and shuddered my way to the pumps with the plan to head home again.

Back on the highway, just getting over the bridge, I was rolling along but the side wind was warmer and really not helping the dodgy water pump under cooling issue so a bridge or two before the Benella turn off I had to stop as the gauge was in the red and I could smell the water/mud(another story) was coming out the overflow. With a lack of sleep the best course of action was to have a snooze under the bridge and wait for the engine to cool down a bit.

When I woke the amount of water/mud missing was not much so I topped it up and jumped in to find that I had all gears back so I rejoined the traffic and started thinking I would find a crossover and continue north again and might still get there by nightfall. As I approached the Benalla Mansfield road I was thinking will I turn around or wont I when Bang....  my decision was made for me. Something had let go in the gearbox or clutch and I had lost all forward torque so I rolled to the left and exited the highway.

A call to RACV, a chat with the local guy who didn't even look under the bonnet(he used to play with 1100 in his younger days) just took my word it was dead and said he wasn't going to fix it in three days so booked my ride home on a tilt tray under Total Care.

So my few days out of the workshop turned into a drive to Wadonga for lunch and ride home in a truck. :)




I haven't had time to get the engine out and find out what has gone wrong but hopefully in a few weeks I will be able to play forensic scientist and report back.

Terry
« Last Edit: April 22, 2018, 08:21:34 PM by Terry »
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Samm

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2018, 08:16:55 PM »
What’s an adventure!

Shame you didn’t make it up Terry but sounds like DS had other ideas.

Few months till Tamworth and the Long Swim- I’m sure you’ll get to the bottom of it.

Samm

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2018, 10:22:10 AM »
So sorry that happened Terry. :(  It would have been a lovely surprise too for everyone if you'd fronted up. ;)

We now look forward to seeing the progress of your rebuild. I'm sure DS will be grateful! :)


    Mazy

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2018, 03:43:42 PM »
Bummer! you were missed!   Hope it sorts out easily for you.
   
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Terry

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2018, 07:01:08 PM »
Hi,

managed to take the sump plug out today and heard the pitter patter of bits of metal landing in the bottom of the container so not good but not unexpected either. The identifiable bits of metal I got off the sump plug were small needle rollers that were in pieces, nothing full length and one had bite marks from a gear tooth so something has been chewing them up.

Terry
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smokey

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2018, 08:13:27 PM »
That's bad luck Terry.   Is that the gearbox you had trouble with in Tassie?

         Cheers
        Smokey

Terry

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2018, 08:20:53 PM »
That's bad luck Terry.   Is that the gearbox you had trouble with in Tassie?

         Cheers
        Smokey

I replaced the case from Tassie because it was distorted and had a hole where the oil came out. but the internals are the same.

Terry.
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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2018, 10:14:12 PM »
That was no good Terry, be keen to see which needle bearing let go.
I bet you have a spare box close at hand though, just in time for when you follow up on the oil pressure issue.

HP
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Terry

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2018, 10:41:44 AM »
That was no good Terry, be keen to see which needle bearing let go.
I bet you have a spare box close at hand though, just in time for when you follow up on the oil pressure issue.

HP

actually I don't have a box handy as they are the earlier type and I had to get an empty casing from a friend after Tassie. I know where there is one under an 1100 but it is a few hours away but will get inside this one first to see what is need first.

I am kind of guessing the idler gear, only because it is about the right size and I have had it fail before.

Terry
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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2018, 11:31:39 AM »
What’s the casing number your after Terry, I have a couple of older style box’s here that may be of use to you.
HP.
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Terry

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2018, 06:59:51 PM »
Hi,

I stripped the engine and gearbox down today to try out my forensic skills but I didn't need to stretch myself to see that the idler gear bearings were what failed taking out pretty much everything else inside the transfer case. It looks like the idler gear bearing in the gearbox has been the start of the failure as it shows the most wear and it has then probably allowed the idler or drop gear to get itself at enough angle to then grab the bearing in the transfer case and it has just chewed its way out behind the flywheel.

The 1st motion gear bearings was in pieces also probably from when all else let go. The drop gear has an interesting redesign of the gear teeth and there is just enough damage on the primary gear and 1st motion input to make them scrap metal. Although the gearbox casing is trashed around the bearing hole, the metal seems not to be amongst the main gears and is all in the transfer housing side so a clean and careful inspection I might be able to transplant the important stuff into another box, again.

The oil pump wasn't as damaged as I thought it should be but it did have a lot of metal grit in it suggesting it was just starting to swallow up the metal. The big end bearings on 2 & 3 were worn down to the copper and actually one of  the #2 shells was in two piece but the crank looks like it will be okay with a light grind so except for the three piece bearing shells in #2 it was no real surprises there as that was where I expected my oil pressure was escaping.

So next step is to get the block and crank etc ready to go to a machine shop and get sorted out and clean up and dismantle the gearbox and find out what else is going on that caused the stuck-in-4th-gear issue.

Thanks HP, I will be in touch.

And some pictures for those who don't like to read. :)







Terry 
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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #11 on: May 05, 2018, 09:12:16 PM »
Looks pretty messy Terry  :(. Still, at least salvaging the crank is a positive.

Fingers crossed that the gearbox is an easier fix than the engine.

KMC - Sounds similar to the symptoms yours is showing. Michael may have a point in wanting to fix it before it gets to this point  ::)


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Terry

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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2018, 08:33:17 PM »
Hi,

I did some more work on cleaning up the engine bits getting them ready to take somewhere tomorrow and found the pistons are not quite as good a shape. Top ring on #1 was broken and #2 piston looks a bit like JFK's head after Dallas with a chunk of the piston, down to at least the 2nd ring, is blown away and the top two rings are broken there as well but the bores are lovely with no marks or scores so very lucky there.

Terry
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Re: One trip too many for DS
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2018, 08:39:39 PM »
but the bores are lovely with no marks or scores so very lucky there.

Extremely lucky I would have thought  :o

To have broken rings on two pistons and bits of one piston missing, but still no marks (let alone gouges) in the bores is going very well indeed.

Sounds like you're in for a pretty full on rebuild in any case Terry, but a big plus if the block is still sound.