Author Topic: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.  (Read 205 times)

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Maystro

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Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« on: July 12, 2020, 08:27:19 PM »
Well the Facet Electric fuel pump had to go. I couldn't get it to be quiet, and I didn't want to move it somewhere where there was enough room to fit it on the cotton reel rubber mounts.
So I ordered a new SU style pump and spent a bit of time trying to fit into a very small space. Had to do it with a full tank of juice didnt I  ::), Its been a week now and I reakon I can still smell the fuel all up my arms  >:(.
Worth it though, so quiet, a small tick as I turn the key, then nothing  ;D, even without rubber mounts I cant hear it at all, awsome  ;D



HP

Hi HP,

I have a facet fuel pump which my mechanic just put in the engine bay with a self taper when my mechanical one gave up the ghost.  I'd  like to move it to some remote location out of the engine bay like you have done with your fancy SU pump.  Im fine with the chattering, Id just like it out of the engine bay which I believe where these pumps are designed to be, close to the tank.   

Can you please give some details of your installation and where you got power from and how you made this secret compartment.

Thanks  Brad.

Halfpint

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2020, 09:43:34 PM »
Hi Brad,
PRU is an '81 model like yours and has a side fill, cylindrical tank fitted in a square'ish box.
So much wasted space in there. Trouble is, its not all that usable due to being quite inaccessible.
But when the tank cover plate is removed, you can use some of the spaces.

https://www.mokeforum.com.au/index.php?topic=7631.msg160744#msg160744

I didnt take any picks of the fabrication, but basically trial fitted the pump on some plate. Then drilled the 2 mounting holes for the pump in the cover, bolted it and tested that it did actually fit in there. Then I cut out enough to mount the pump and get the filter in.
Cut, drilled, and tapped a 5/16 unf thread into 4 bits of flat bar. Bolted them all up to the piece I cut out of the cover plate. Clamped it in and welded the tabs in place. Then it went for painting.

The pump is simply wired into to security circuit via the accessory curcuit. The pump only runs when the ignition is on.
Simples  ;)

On the Cooper S engines there is no hole in the block for a mechanical fuel pump, and given the mini fuel tanks were in the Boot, the fuel pump was often mounted to the rear sub frame and fuel was pumped all the way to the carbie from there.

For many years I had an electric fuel pump under the side pod cover over the tank level sender, but again, the ticking noise interfered with the ambiance of the A series engine idle at traffic lights  >:(
The happiest of people don't always have the best of everything, they just make the best of everything they have.

Maystro

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2020, 10:12:21 PM »
Thanks HP, just looked at your rebuild and it looks sweet as and better than a new one. 

That fuel pump installation may seem like a simple job for you but that seems pretty daunting to me. 

I want to drop my subframe out and give my body a whole new refurbishment so I think I will wait till then.  After all I am going to be probably replacing the front floor pans where I have some serious rust. 

Thanks Brad

Halfpint

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2020, 10:59:07 PM »
Brad,
The Facet pumps are very reliable and dependable. You could move it if you want to without doing any cutting or modifying etc.
Your pump is already wired in and runs, extending the wires , and even the fuel lines shouldnt be too hard. But I dont think it will fit under the side pod top cover. An SU style might though.
If you unbolt the plate under your tank, you can see the fuel line pick up and then its pretty easy to tap into and run the fuel line to where ever you want it. The tank pick up is directly below the sender.

.

A day working on the Moke has to be fun  :)

The happiest of people don't always have the best of everything, they just make the best of everything they have.

FNQ

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2020, 02:56:53 PM »
I am pretty sure the facet and SU pumps are designed as push pumps, ( they are not as good pulling/drawing the fuel)  and only have a moderate specification on lift .. So ideally mount the electric pump closer to the fuel tank than the carbie and in a nice and low place. Both facet and SU are very good, but i agree Tony the SU is way quieter


Maystro

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2020, 06:56:44 PM »
Your right FNQ, that is one of the reasons I want to get it out of the engine bay and closer to the tank. 

HP,  I have explored every part of my Moke over the past 30 years but I have never removed that panel under the tank.  I think it is time to look around and see what lurks within. 

Thanks for the idea.  I'm sure I'll find somewhere to fit a fuel pump.  I just have to make sure all my connections are secure and I'll still have the fuel filter in the engine bay.  Do you see any problems with this HP?

Thanks Brad

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2020, 07:40:47 PM »
The only problem is accessing the pump under the panel. Other than that, why not?
You should get a long life out of the pump though.
HP
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Steam

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2020, 07:46:48 PM »
I li,e the sond of the facet, it lets me know I have fuel, the sound from pumping to freewheeling (ie the float bowl is full) is different.  Mine is mounteed on rubber but you can still hear it before starting the engine, however I cannot hear it when  the engine is running. I also added a fuel tap near the pump and a cut off switch on the dash both for security and piece of mind.
Cheers, Dave

Maystro

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2020, 08:08:52 PM »
HP,  just think of  my panel I have to remove for inspection a little bigger than yours ;-) 

I'm like you Steam, I hear this pump doing it's  thing at start up but once the engine is running I don't hear a thing.  However because this  pump is so close to the carby it starts to push fuel out of the overflow pipe in the fuel bowl if I leave it on for too long. 

Steam can you tell me about your  fuel shut off switch? 

Thanks Brad.

Steam

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2020, 07:42:10 AM »
The fuel tap is a standard ball valve 1/4 turn on the line from the tank so it shuts off all fuel.
 The supply from the ignition switch goes to a standard toggle switch on the dash then to the pump. Nothing serious needed as the pump has a low current draw.
Cheers, Dave

yellaterra

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2020, 12:59:41 PM »
   Hi Maystro,     Another security solution is to use a fuel solenoid from a Lpg set up. Plenty kicking around the wrecking yards or new if you wish. Powered on by secret switch fuel flows, turned off no fuel flows.  Can be placed anywhere in fuel line for security only needs power. Run it off a relay to be double safe if you want. 

Maystro

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2020, 05:18:34 PM »
Thanks guys for some great  ideas I definitely have to think about once I work out where I'm going to mount this fuel pump. 

Hey HP, I was lying on my back on cold concrete today trying to undo bolts holding this bottom fuel tank plate that haven't seen a spanner for nearly 40 years and thinking I don't think my plan is going to work.  Especially if I'm on a road trip and the fuel pump fails. 

I took off the top inspection plate for the fuel tank and managed to find some space to test fit the facet fuel pump.  It seems their is enough space if I mount it upside down and just put two hex bolts through the top bulk head.  Did I read this is what you had before you went to the 10th degree of perfection?

Just a couple of questions again sorry? 

Just wandering which fuel line I should hook into and why is their so many.  I have 4 fuel lines going forward and 3 go rear? 

Also plenty of coloured wires.  Would you remember which colour you hooked into seeming we both have 81 Mokes. 





Thanks Brad.


Sharks

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2020, 05:55:17 PM »
Hi Brad,

If you see HP's picture:


The 'Fuel lines' up the top are actually breathers. They allow the tank to depressurise after fuel has been sucked out of it, however I do not know why the breather line is so long and goes from one end of the tank to the other three times.
The hose that carries fuel to the engine is located roughly in the middle down the bottom of the tank. You'll probably have to remove the protective cover under the tank to reach it. Note that it does go up into the 'cabin' and through the firewall, hidden by the cover in the corner under the parcelshelf.

I'm afraid I can't help with the colour of the wires either as our moke has had a couple of wiring looms throughout its lifetime!

Cheers,
Sharks

Maystro

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2020, 06:46:21 PM »
Thanks Sharks,

Looks like I'm going to have to remove that bottom fuel tank cover after all and find some penetrene to loosen those 40 your old stubborn nuts to find the fuel feed?  Is that the pipe cut off on the bottom of the tank on HP's photo? 

At least I will only be doing this once to find the pipe and bring it up to where it is more accessible by the top cover plate.   

Thanks Brad

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Re: Relocate the electric fuel pump to the side box.
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2020, 06:58:50 PM »
Hi Brad,

Not cut off, just not hooked up to anything. See photo of our '81 tank with half a fuel hose still hanging from it:


The way I see it, the bottom has to come off. Maybe theres another way? You did mention before that HP may have mounted a pump up top, but I didn't catch that part of the conversation earlier on.

Hope that helps,
Sharks